Garmin-style
Try to guess whose jersey this is?
Dec 10, 2010
RC
Big News! L5 Riders Council have their jackets in and they actually look pretty nice. Not long until they can impress the rookies with those jackets at rookie week. LEss than 10weeks until rookie week and a little over 4 months until Teter and Cutters win again.
Garmin-style
Try to guess whose jersey this is?
Garmin-style
Try to guess whose jersey this is?
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62 comments:
Cutters aren't going to win again; Young can't do it all and Lusk can't do a thing on the track. Word on the street is Patches has left the team too? Hope they have good rookies...
Do all the Cutters' have those nicknames?
Forgive me for saying so, but that's kind of lame.
(yes, I'm going anonymous on this one)
It had to happen. Lets rank who will win this year.
Anonymous Rankings:
Top Teams For April:
1.Cutters/Bakehouse - Lets win this so I can go pro. Lets win this so I can show people the rings I didnt earn. I can ride more than 10 laps this year.
2.Fijis/Bros - Do we really have to train for the race, it worked so well in the past? Only Cutters caught us before.
3.Delts/Roids - What lap do we make a move on? Never, the plan is to never make a move. Same as always. Just sit.
4.Sigma Chi/Roys - We can win. Wait, is that chain on. We can win.
5.GGC/GGC - Race little 5 and you may get some free stuff. Or discounted at least. The real races are in the summer.
6. Beta/TFM - Im the shit. Our team is the shit. Lie down and take it.
7.PDT/4Loko -Let me show you how much I can drink. First, I will try to make an ill-advised early move, it will work.
8.BKB/Pro - Goal #1, lets not get lapped. Goal #2, lets get Ren Jay back. Give us a chance.
9.Hoosier Climber?/What? - Im a deer. Im a deer. Wait, Im a hunter?
10.Phi Psi/Face - Pole High/Finish Low. Its our year to not succeed.
Why go outside 10...
Not reading into what you just wrote, I would say
1.Cutters
2.Beta
3.Sigma Chi
4.Fiji
5.Delts
those jackets look awesome. Kudos to the mastermind behind the design.
who knows who knows! its always good to be under the radar
I'm tired of listening to the same old whining about the Cutters. While Eric Young is a talented cyclist, beating the Cutters is not an impossible feat. If all members of your team are willing to maintain a high number of training hours through the winter, compete in ALL collegiate cycling races, and participate in ALL competitive group rides, your chances of success at Little 5 increases dramatically. It's no secret folks. Training ONLY with your team and practicing exchanges will not cut it.
The Cutters only train with their team...
Wait why does everyone always make fun of Delts with steroid jokes?
Love the ratings but what does "I'm a deer, i'm a deer, wait i'm a hunter mean?"
That was the first time I have heard of a steroid joke aimed at Delts. I'd say its because James C. has a large stature for a cyclist.
RJ Stuart
Correct me if I am wrong, but if you do every collegiate cycling race you will miss Little 5. I would find it sad to miss Quals, MissNOut, Team Pursuit, and the race.
Racing doesn't determine the race outcome. Neither does training with others. Its will. And those pesky officials.
Race Rankings for 2011:
1. Phi Gamma Delta - Ted Boeglin, Dave Ellis, Rhet Deinlein
2. Cutters - Eric "I tip-toed around the rules to be a Cat 1 and ride Little 5" Young
3. Delt Tau Delta - James Coudright, RJ Stuart
4. G.G.C. - Ryan Kiel and Brian Holthouse...maybe the 3rd RJ
5. Sigma Chi - Kyle Straight, Drew Morrow and Adam Fish
6. Phi Delta Theta - Chris West, Steve Sharp
~Don
What's with the names associated with each team? Riders of course but last I checked there are 4 guys on a team. If your 4th rider crashes the race is practically over so including all 4 riders is necessary
Is that last post from Lusk again? I thought you'd quit BVN?
"Racing doesn't determine the race outcome."
There's a reason for banning Cat. 1s.
That rule should be abolished or amended. One of the top riders in the Midwest already competes in Little 5 anyways.
If you have a problem with the rules go talk to the people who make them. If you need directions to the bunker people at the Wilcox office I would be happy to assist. Until then stop complaining and start mashing.
Since I did voice my opinion to Pam Loebig I will go ahead and say what I need to say:
I believe that if Eric Young is allowed to ride then Ren-jay Shei and Graham Dewart should be allowed to ride as well. I have no connection to either of these guys seeing as they are on BKB and Beta respectively. I'm not attacking Cutters (like most people) however I am trying to make the race more competitive and fair. Who wouldn't like to see more competition in the race? It would only make things more interesting. I don't want to put words in Eric Young's mouth, but I would be willing to bet he would welcome the competition. Right now as it stands there is too much disparity between the "field" and a handful of riders.
I also think it's a shame that the people who love the event and cycling as a whole are the same people who are denying these two individuals from arguably the most memorable experience at I.U.
I am NOT trying to stir stuff up, but I'm posting this with genuine interest in bettering Little 5 and the experience of all the riders.
Yes, the rules say what they say, but why not let them ride?
RJ Stuart
Well said Mr. Stuart; I will post to that!
Don, and everyone else who think that it matters that Eric Young is a cat 1,
First off he did not bypass any rules. Read the manual that is given to every single rider. He started as a cat 5. Secondly, being a cat 1 does not matter. When I rode in '08 we had zero Cat 1's. Myself and Sasha were Cat 2;s. We competed against Issac Neff and Mike Sherer who were both 1's, and we won. Therefore, I present this to you. If being a Cat 1 is the end all then why did they not win the race?Sherer is now a professional cyclist yet he never won little 5. Little 5 is a completely different beast. Quit complaining and HTFU. The rule was followed to the letter. I am sorry that you would rather make excuses as to why you are going to lose. I hate to tell you but you could win. The Cutters winning is only a forgone conclusion because you allow it to be. Maybe you might want to focus on your team and your training. (there are a few teams that do).
Hamilton
(feel free to comment or get in touch with me directly, I would love to talk to you about it.)
I simply do not understand. If you think you are going to lose why waste your time at all Either shut up and train, then show up in April knowing you can win or just sit in the stands and drink a beer.
P.s Well said RJ. I say let everyone ride.
This is all so funny. This is not hard. Look at the rule book. Eric came in as a Cat 5 rode in 2 races and then upgraded to a cat 1 after his 2nd race. That is allowed in the rules. Same as Neff, Sasha, Hamilton, Shei and myself.
However for Shei he raced last year in L5 as a Cat 2. Which makes him not allowed to race this year. Dewart came in as a cat 2 and is diffidently not allowed to race.
And as Hamilton stated. I consider myself a good road racer and did very poorly in L5. It is a very different skill set. That's why it is so amazing that Eric Young can kill it on both the L5 track and the road.
If all you riders are scared, put in the miles, train hard, and stay focused. Don't worry about all this crap.
I miss the good ol' days when riders council members wore a bright orange hunting vest.
Sherer I think we all understand the rules by now. Thanks for the reiteration. However I think you might be missing the crux of the matter in RJ Stuart's post. I think what he is trying to say...correct me if I am wrong ...Ethically, why are Grahm and RJ not allowed to ride? The rules are there, but is it really fair to say "sorry you aren't allowed to ride in little 5 you got too good too fast."
In reality there is a rider in the race (young) who is better than both of these guys on the road, track and little 5 arena yet they aren't allowed to race against him because they got too good too early in their life? Seems odd we are punishing them for being "too good" and as you said road racing legs don't necessarily transfer over to a good set of little 5 legs so who is worried about them?
Spartacus
I was on RC when this rule was enacted. The rule is in place to not punish riders like Young that have put hard work in during their short time at IU. It would not be fair for someone who came to IU with no experience to be held back on the road until after graduation.
This rule allows for someone to improve themselves over a couple of years and then race a final time as a cat 1 or 2. This is why Shei cannot ride this year because he already used his one year exemption.
The reason that anyone other than a category 5 is barred from using this exemption is to prevent recruiting (the reason that 1's and 2's were originally banned). Cannot have everything in the world.
I agree with others when I say go out and work hard to try to beat them. I sure as hell never beat them (in the race), but still think Young and those that have used the exemption before should be able to ride.
"to prevent recruiting (the reason that 1's and 2's were originally banned)."
I believe you are laboring under a misconception. The elimination of Cat 1's and 2's had nothing to do with recruiting.
Tom
Kushnick: well said. I agree. w/ hamilton too...stop whining. ride or drink a beer.
Tom...care to explain?
and isn't it still an argument to continue to have a limit on time as a 1/2?
"Shit. We need those BetAs to beat the Cutters. Let Dewart ride so they can win. Let the Betas win...."
I understand the rule is meant to make it so that everything is fair. Currently, I dont want fairness. That is what we are saying. It will be better in the long run if we play by the rules. The other option would be to change the rule and see the results in the future. In that scenario top cyclists come in in 15-20 years, like Eric Young Jr, Verdell Jones IV, and Luke Armstrong and competd in this great event. Stacking teams is whats at stake.
Sure, this year its different. This year Dewart makes Beta go from a 4 to a 4.5, and Shei makes BKB a 4 instead of a 3. Not a race annihilator. That doesnt mean that some team down the road wont take that new rule and really ruin the competitiveness of the race. Ie 1970s. 2008.
This is not even a good attempt at posting as me. Changing from third person to first person is a give away and bad form.
Debating the rule on this board is pointless. Go in and make your case to Dana Cummings if you think it needs to be changed. Drew's comment about Cat 1's and 2's being removed from the race because of rider recruitment is incorrect.
Tom
Care to inform us the correct reasoning then Tom?
Peripheral to the main issue is whether Graham Dewart will be able to ride on the track at all, participate in series events etc? I assume Renjay will be able to do this (as a member of RC) so I guess Graham will be able to as well. It might be more frustrating for him to 'see what might have been' but would help him as a potential coach.
What is wrong with a healthy debate on this thread? Perhaps it is for the betterment of the race? I don't see anything wrong with what is taking place here. Posts have been mostly civil, thoughtful, interesting, and even entertaining at times. Furthermore, many individuals will never set foot in Wilcox house. However, their opinions are still worth hearing.
Neil
It is my understanding that Ren Jay is allowed to be on the track in his roll as an RC member and not as an eligible member of the 2011 BKB team, which he is technically not. His inclusion was based on the availability of a veteran, knowledgeable rider to focus on helping teams, not on trying to provide him with another year of eligibility. My guess is that this will be watched carefully by a lot of teams. I have also been informed that he is not able to participate in any Little 500 event.
As far as the "correct reasoning", I never thought there was any rational reasoning behind the Cat2 rule. The short version is below. The long version is at
www.little500.com/cat1/index.html
(Note, this was written in 2000)
The actual decision to eliminate Cat 2 riders came as a result of a conversation IUSF staff and race officials had with Todd Hancock (Delta Chi). At the time IUSF believed that the Cat 1 and Cat 2 riders just viewed this as just another race. They would participate and then leave. The IUSF and IUF have always viewed the Little 500 as an important way to create loyal alumni as well as potential donors for I.U. These "new" riders presented a dilemma for both organizations. Their belief was that not only did these USCF riders not have any loyalty to the university; they were discouraging potential riders (and hence potential future donors) from being involved. Sometime after the 1993 race, Hancock (the 1993 champion) was asked if Little 500 was the most important race he ever participated in. Todd commented that he had raced in much more important races than Little 5. If there was a moment in time when the movement to eliminate Cat 2 riders became essential to the IUSF, it was when Hancock made that statement. The IUSF viewed that statement as confirmation of what they had suspected. That the Cat 1, and now Cat 2, USCF cyclists stood in direct conflict with the goals of Little 500. Those riders wanted to come in and win "just another race". IUSF believed they (the USCF riders) were changing the race into one that would never produce loyal alumni. And the IUSF and IUF would never let that happen.
This is what happens when you make a rule exemption. Suddenly you now a have a Cat 1 rider that is allowed to ride but Cat 2's who are not. Cutters want all best riders to ride and when Hans got in we wanted him in. (oops)
It's the rider's responsibility to stay within the rules if he wants to ride. Clearly Eric stopped racing when he was a Cat 3 because his passion was Little 500. The guys that Cat'ed up knew they only had one year to ride if they chose that and they went ahead and decided Little 5 was not as important as the summer. Kerberg did this back in the day too. Now they all want to race but can't.
The question is, would they go back in time and stay a Cat 3 now that they are itching to race again?
The Cutters are groomed into thinking that Little 500 is the most important or fun race they will ever ride in (usually true), so they plan ahead and purposely don't cat up.
Little things like that keep the team stronger.
Woj
1) Townies
2) Phi Delta Fire Breathers
3) Fee-Gee
4) Sigmotchi
5) Team A that doesn't work (Jordan)
6) Team B that doesn't work (Extension)
7) Fi Si
8) Beta Kappa Beta
9) Charcoal Llama
10) Who really cares at this point...
1)Fiji
2)Beta
3)Phi Delt
4)Cutters
5)GGC
6)BKB
7)Delts
8)Sigma Chi
9)Cru
10)Phi Psi
I don't know one rider who is opposed to Graham Dewart or Ren-jay Shei riding in the race. Let them ride. Simply put if cat 1's are allowed then cat 2's are allowed. Start a vote (riders only) and give the results to Pam.
Anyone with one of those new fancy jacket should take initiative on this..
Yes, lets take a poll here and get 132 anonymous posters saying they are riders and want anyone who wants to ride to ride, heck bring Clayton back for another 3 or 4 years. Who needs rules anyway.
is anyone opposed to dewart or ren-jay riding? i didn't know that. i'm certainly not.
the problem is that, however great it would be for them to ride, according to the rules, they're ineligible.
keep up, come on now.
If you make an exception to the rule regardless of people's requests then you open a big can of worms with anyone in the future. Learn your rules
This would be like seeing a 40mph sign, blow by it at 60mph, getting a ticket and then arguing to the judge that the speed limit there should be 70mph and you shouldn’t have to pay a fine.
Rules are meant to be amended and changed. This rule is old school. You are robbing these guys of a lifelong experience. If you are afraid of competition then that's one thing, but if you are just saying the rules are the rules then you are ignorant. Go ride a bike and just get ready for April. Let them ride Pamela.
I am all for amendments. Lets free this up to make it more fair. Amend the rule to make it Cat 2s eligible. Somehow the rule though will have to be changed to avoid someone coming in as a cat 2 freshman and riding 4 years without racing in the summer or doing some kind of progression. So maybe make it Cat 2 is an eligible rider, once you are at Cat 2 you get only so long before you are out. Say 2 years. So say you come in as a 2, you get 2. Thats incentive for both good riders to still come to IU for Little 5, competitiveness, and progression.
1.Kutters
2.Beta
3.Fiji
4.Phi Delt
5.Sigma Chi
6.Hoosier Climber
7.GGC
8.Delts
9.Phi Psi
10.Sigma Nu
Eric Young wins by 3 laps.
Hey, all you whiners out there racing for 2nd place:
Grow a pair and HTFU. Start training and quit complaining!
Dont listen to that advice, take it from me. I was minding my business one day, not complaining, when boom I grew a pair.
Now what am I supposed to do? My man is about to come home from Afghanistan and I have testes? Life isnt fair, and I'm sure he wont believe me that I grew a pair.
Cutters are seriously pieces of shit. They honestly care about one thing and that's winning little 5. What happens after graduation? I am sure the townies have great connections.
TFM
1. Cutters haven't been townies since Breaking Away.
2. Pre-townies no. Post-townies hell yeah.
Tom makes the case that Cat1/2 rider discourage other people from riding Little 500 because they have no chance of winning- this cuts down on their potential donations to IUF. I can see some logic if you accept the thesis that IUF/IUSF is ALL about the $. However extending that thesis a little would surely mean that IUSF would be actively trying to prevent Cutters from perpetually winning the race because upon graduation Cutters are either found at the unemployment office or making minimum wage waiting tables at the Bakehouse. People who are competitive for the win will surely give more $ back to IUF/IUSF so ensuring rich frat boys get a chance at top five must be the aim for the Foundation? The rise of the independents must be a nightmare for IUF! In short, ban Eric Young, let a frat win for a change and the $ will come rolling back to IUF!
I didn't make that case; I was against the Cat2 rule because at the time IUSF did nothing to help the teams who filled in at the bottom when the ones at the top were effectively removed. Almost 2 decades ago when the rule was put in place, there was little thought to the law of “unintended consequences”. The students that IUSF claimed were waiting to be involved but didn’t ride because they didn’t have a chance to win were nonexistent just as they were nowhere to be found when IUSF tried to dump alumni coaches.
In 2005, when they let the Cat2’s back in, it was viewed as a change that benefited Hans Arnesen because they made the revision and made it retroactive. Hans, who had upgraded to a Cat2 before the rule change, was given him one more go at the race after being relegated in 2005 for cutting off Chris Vargo of out of turn 4 of the last lap.
Making a rule change as a result of Eric Young’s considerable talent is short sighted. And unless it is well thought out and is implemented in a way that people can prepare for it, you end up creating more problems than you solve. For example, if you do make a change, you make it effective with the incoming freshman in 2011, not make it retroactive to remove Eric. As a member of Riders Council said back in the 90’s, “Why can't people beat other teams on the track instead of trying to get them kicked out of the race"?
Cutters make donations in the form of Bakehouse sandwiches. I make donations straight from my American Express Black card.
Frat
Tom, now you are wrong. Hans was relegated in 2004, not 2005. Dodds won the race in 2005 and Hans and ATO won in 2006.
Old people get their years mixed up. it will happen to you too someday if you have 30 years of racing to remember
"Anonymous said...
Cutters make donations in the form of Bakehouse sandwiches. I make donations straight from my American Express Black card.
Frat"
The greatest thing about little 5, is that flashyness never prevails...On that note feel free to buy me a jaga bamb at Sports after your 22nd place finish in the race ;-)
I thought this blog post was suppose to be about Ren-Jay's sweet new jacket?
@ TFM
Serious pieces of shit? Getting nasty because you don't have the legs to win really doesn't make excuses for a personal attack. These guys are no different or cocky, on or off the track, than anyone else so cut the BS.
Just imagine, maybe I'm wrong and you win, then you can be a "serious piece of shit" too. Best of luck.
I never knew a jacket could be so controversial.
"Anonymous said...
I never knew a jacket could be so controversial."
Too many sexually frustrated riders ;-)
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